China: 156 killed after Muslim Uigurs revolt against Chinese Government

by Claudia on July 7, 2009 · Comments

WSJ:

Xinhua quoted Liu Yaohua, a senior police official in Xinjiang, as saying that rioters had burned 261 vehicles, including 190 buses and two police cars, several of which were still ablaze as of Monday morning. Mr. Liu said the death toll of 140 “would still be climbing.”

NYT:

The casualty toll, if confirmed, would make this the deadliest outbreak of violence in China in many years.

The death toll has finally climbed to 156.  BBC has the images from the riots and the confrontations with police.

If there is something that strikes me, is that MSM refer to this as an “ethnic” problem. It’s true that Uighurs are a different race from mayority Chinese Han, but it’s not the only difference. The other is religion: Uighurs are Muslims and are asking independence from China for some years now. As we can see, the police has employed itself  fully against them.

Cross-posted from Tea And Politics.

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  • Ahmed_2009
    Dear ALl,

    you all are misunderstand what is islam, please correct your information before you say something like that about muslims.
    Muslims are defending thair lives against the real infidels.
    Infidels like Israel who killed women and childrens, attacking unarmed civilians with bombs and rockets.
    Israel the biggest threat in the world, jews are known with trason and lies.
    jews who claims the holocost, and guess what holocost has never happend.
    Mr.JEWHAWK don`t poison the people's mind with your black ideas.

    Dears if you want to know what is real islam is visit tis link for more information http://www.islamicity.com/

    Thanks.
  • magiaghaee
    Ahmed its Muslims that you that give the Holy Prophet a bad name. Your ignorance and utter lack of mental faculties is the reason why the entire ummah condoned the actions of the various nefarious Caliphates and continue to support harming civilians. Read the Quran in its context. and the Holocaust did happen. A lie can't move millions of Jews to Palestine.
  • Storm_Rider
    Ahmed_2009
    Islam is similar to Nazism or Communism, but with a cloak of religion. Islam is a Supremacist Totalitarian Political Ideology first and foremost. Islam demands that all men (and women) are not created equal; men are politically and socially superior to women, and Muslims are politically and socially superior to non-Muslims. Islam demands that individuals are not endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights including life, liberty and pursuit of happiness (private property); rather, Islam is destructive of our sacred God-given human rights. Islam does not derive government power through the consent of the governed, but rather through a religious/political oligarchy unaccountable to "We the People." As defined by the American Declaration of Independence, Islam is a form of totalitarian tyranny; and since you are an agitator for this religious/political tyranny, you are the enemy of the United States, and you are my enemy.

    “I have sworn upon the altar of God, eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man.” Thomas Jefferson
  • magiaghaee
    How do you demand that all men are not created equal? I am confused by the grammar here. It's funny because I distinctly remember reading in the Quran that all Men and Women stand as equals in the eyes of G-d. Religious/political oligarchy unaccountable to "We the People" well what do you think the protests in Iran were about? Also I think you should be more worried about Wall Street executives running away with billions of tax payer money than some crazy ragheads in a cave in Pakistan. Believe me Bin Laden couldn't land the U.S into some financial crisis, leave that to the investment banks.
  • Storm_Rider
    Muslims are politically and socially superior to non-Muslims under Islamic Sharia Law. All non-Muslims who fall under the control of an Islamic Government must pay a special tax called jizya. This is arbitrary totalitarian law, and it violates the American Declatation of Independence.

    Koran: 9,29:

    YUSUFALI: "Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued."

    PICKTHAL: "Fight against such of those who have been given the Scripture as believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, and forbid not that which Allah hath forbidden by His messenger, and follow not the Religion of Truth, until they pay the tribute readily, being brought low."

    SHAKIR: "Fight those who do not believe in Allah, nor in the latter day, nor do they prohibit what Allah and His Messenger have prohibited, nor follow the religion of truth, out of those who have been given the Book, until they pay the tax in acknowledgment of superiority and they are in a state of subjection."

    http://www.usc.edu/schools/college/crcc/engagem...
  • magiaghaee
    Taking Quranic verses out of context that's real smart. And by the way the American Declaration of Independence was written by a bunch of slaveholders. Don't wave it like the biblem its not an infallible document. And muslims pay zakat and khums to the government. It's called revenues for the government. Zakat and Jizya are equivalent taxes. Oh btw the three translations you have put up are questionable. YusufAli is a hardcore wahhabi and some of his translations are just plain stupid or literal, very reflective of the narrow minds of Wahhabis. Pickthal is basically a reprint of Yusufali. I don't know Shakir very well. Plus this verse if I remember correctly were given at time when the pagans or their Jewish allies were attacking the Muslims. This is not cart blanche for Muslims to attack everybody. If it was Muslims all over the world would be fighting and that is not the case. You should be aware that some of the Quranic verses are one time only obligations.
  • Storm_Rider
    magiaghaee: “the American Declaration of Independence was written by a bunch of slaveholders. Don't wave it like the biblem its not an infallible document.”

    What part of “We hold these truths to be self-evident , that all men are created equal” is infallible?

    What part of “That they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness” is infallible?

    What part of “That to secure these rights government are created among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed” is infallible?

    Many of our American Founding Fathers were not slaveholders; and even though Thomas Jefferson owned slaves, he was instrumental in outlawing the slave trade, and he began freeing his slaves but died before he finished. Slavery in the New World was not an American enterprise; it was European: French, British, Dutch, Spanish, etc. etc. Thomas Jefferson was born into a world of European-developed slavery; and the Muslim world was an essential ingredient in the enterprise as they were already culling African slaves and selling for profit to the Europeans.

    “Slavery was practiced in Africa before the beginning of the Atlantic slave trade. Slavery and the slave trade were an integral part of African societies and states which supplied the Arab world with enslaved people for centuries before the arrival of the Europeans…The African continent was bled of its human resources via all possible routes; across the Sahara, through the Red Sea, from the Indian Ocean ports and across the Atlantic. At least ten centuries of slavery for the benefit of the Muslim countries (from the ninth to the nineteenth). ... Four million enslaved people exported via the Red Sea, another four million through the Swahili ports of the Indian Ocean, perhaps as many as nine million along the trans-Saharan caravan route, and eleven to twenty million (depending on the author) across the Atlantic Ocean.”

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlantic_slave_trade

    “As the French empire in North America grew, the French also began to build a smaller but more profitable empire in the West Indies. Settlement along the South American coast in what is today French Guiana began in 1624, and a colony was founded on Saint Kitts in 1625 ...The Compagnie des eacute;les de l'Amérique founded colonies in Guadeloupe and Martinique in 1635, and a colony was later founded on Saint Lucia by (1650). The food-producing plantations of these colonies were built and sustained through slavery, with the supply of slaves dependent on the African slave trade.”

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_North_Africa

    “In the 18th century, France carried on two types of trade with its New World colonies. One was the direct trade by which France sent wheat, wine, metal objects, and building materials to the New World in exchange for sugar, and, to a lesser degree, cotton, cocoa, tobacco, rocou, and coffee. The other was the triangular slave trade, which the French referred to as the "circuit" trade. French ships loaded with trade goods sailed to Africa, where the goods were exchanged for slaves. The slaves were then taken to France's New World colonies, where they were exchanged for sugar and other plantation products.”

    http://yaleglobal.yale.edu/display.article?id=1587

    “The Du Bois Institute dataset lists 4,033 slaving voyages by French-registered ships destined for the Americas that sailed between 1669 and 1864. It excludes a large number of voyages whose final destination lay in the Indian Ocean.”

    http://www.historycooperative.org/cgi-bin/justt...

    “In the history of the Atlantic slave trade, the French turned four times as many Africans into slaves as the Americans did, they used them far more brutally, and French slavers not only got a head-start on Americans, they continued the slave trade--legally--until 1830, long after the rest of Europe had given it up. And they kept at it clandestinely until after the U.S. Civil War. France officially abolished slavery in its colonies only 14 years before Lincoln's Emancipation Proclamation, and then only under pressure from slave uprisings.”

    • Slaver voyages: France, 4,200; British North America/United States, 1,500.
    • Slaves transported: France 1,250,000, British North America/United States, 300,000.
    • Slaves delivered to: French West Indies: 1,600,000, British North America/United States, 500,000.*

    http://vernondent.blogspot.com/2005/05/french-s...

    “The British transatlantic slave trade, which flourished from the mid-seventeenth century until the early nineteenth century, was a major conduit for the enforced migration of Africans to the Americas. Between 1660 and 1807 over three million Africans were dispatched to the Americas in British vessels.”

    http://www.pickeringchatto.com/major_works/the_...

    magiaghaee, you are an uninformed anti-American Islamist; or would that be Marxist? No difference in regards to destruction of human rights and anti-Americanism.
  • Storm_Rider
    No, these Quranic verses speak for themselves and they are within context. Your Islamist mind tricks won't work here.

    Hardcore Wahhabi Islam is the "Islamic Reformation"; the Reformation of Islam is not in the direction of unaleinable human rights to life, liberty and private property, nor is it in the direction of law derived from the majority within a Constitutional framework which secures those human rights. The Islamic Reformation is retrograde; it takes us back to seventh century tyranny hybridized with twentieth century totalitarianism.

    http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=25155...

    magiaghaee, you are either a fool or an enemy agitator; an enemy of the United States in either case.
  • Storm_Rider
  • magiaghaee
    These are just blogs. And what you see in the Islamic world is a result of backward indigenous male chauvinist cultures. Women don't even get their Islamic rights. Do not confuse Islamic "culture" with Islamic theology. And you are typically quoting or bringing forth evidence from Salafists or Wahhabis which most Muslims with a decent knowledge of the Quran regard as heretics.
  • Storm_Rider
    Blogs are created by real people who are not controlled by the Party, the Clergy or the State; real individuals who have a God-given right to free speech. Your elitist view of the individual reflects a totalitarian mind - the very linkage between Marxism and Islam.
  • hellosnackbar
    Ahmed 2009(it's as though you were born yesterday)
    What is Islam?besides a pernicious death cult containing: child indoctrination,honour killings,murder of infidels,taqiya,suicide bombings,a barbaric system of law,submission to an imaginary deity,fairy stories about heavenly rewards for murder,
    the acceptance that an illiterate murdering 7th century Arab potentate is a model for all to follow,unrealisable ambitions to make the whole world submit to Islamic rule.
    I see Islam as like a metaphorical piece of dogshit clinging to the shoe of the body politic.(you can't see it but its stench is forever irritating your olfactories)
    Go on give me those tired canards like :I need to understand the beauty of Islam,or that Allah will barbecue me on the day of judgement,or moronic Muslims are not getting a fair crack of the whip,or that I should respect primitive people who spend time wailing and bumping their head against the floor.
    The practice of Islam is an activity for the feeble minded as evidenced by their piss poor performance in all aspects of academic life(let's see Saudi sand monkeys build
    an air plane or a submarine).
    It's like being told that mental defficiency confers advantage.
    Have I missed something Ahmed?do tell!
    BTW I just told Allah what a useless turd she is and await my punishment.
  • JEWHAWK
    Ahmed 609 A.D:
    I don't need to "poison the people's mind" nor I do have "black ideas",for your
    DAMNED DEATH CULT that you call "islam" already does exactly those things.Islam is EVIL and downright IMMORAL from its very start,all because the CHARLATAN,ASSASSIN,RAPIST,THIEF and PEDOPHILE Mohammad INVENTED the unholy Qu'ran.
    Since then,the world became a lousy place.That's a fact.

    "the holocost has never happened"

    Sir,you simply have got no CREDIBILTY whatsoever.This remark proves that you're a simpleton,a jerk and an ignoramus.It's not your fault,mind you,for ALL muslims believe in nonsense since their birth.
    For this,I really believe that islam doesn't belong to our current time,but to
    the 7th Century.
    If you think that people who reads this blog will buy your Taq'qya,you're losing your time.We are very well aquainted with islamic tactics.We know that muslims drink,eat and breath LIES on a daily basis...and reckon that we,Kaffirs,will also believe.
  • magiaghaee
    Do you really think that breathing fire will solve anything? Your tirades serve no purpose other than to make you feel better. But then you harden the resolve of those who you are fighting? Then again I am well acquainted with your tactics. and have no need to remind me that you just make the problem worse.
  • SirWilhelm
    Take your taqqiya to another site Ahmed, the infidels here understand too well what Islam is really about. And your Islamanazi lies about the Holocaust don't help any either. Islam and Nazis blame the Jews equals IslamaNazis.
  • diliip
    hai dears,
    here we discuse about last violence of uighur muslims and china people fight and death . islam people they are doing 5 times prayer per day islam teach their people kill other relign people? or continue bomb blast? or flight hijack everthing they are doing final they call allah! .we cannot change them but they will change automatic one day that time is not so long....,
  • SirWilhelm
    This is what I'd like to see more off: http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,530561,00.h...
    The Han Chinese civilians taking matters into their own hands and giving the Muslims a taste of their own medicine. In a way, you could say the people are deciding the issue amongst themselves. The violence is unfortunate, and it's hard to say who started it, but knowing Muslims, it was inevitable.
  • magiaghaee
    A simple look at the history of Communist China will show you how this began. With Mao's totalitarian view of a uniform society anybody who is outside the norm was persecuted. Xianjing and Tibet were the most brutal examples. The unrest in the last two years is a direct response to Chinese occupation. I assuming you are an Englishman based on your username. Do you not remember England's history with the Roman occupation?
  • SirWilhelm
    Please notice, I mentioned the Han Chinese civilians, I did not defend the Chinese Communists or their govt. I agree they are totalitarian and oppressive in their own way. Then again, you did not pick up on the part of the article where the Uighar claim of occupation is disputed by the Han Chinese who came there with the expertise to make use of the resources available that the Uighars lacked. The Han can't understand why the Uighars don't appreciate the advances they have made in the economy and living standards which clash with the Uighars MUSLIM culture and beliefs. This is where Muslims clash with all other cultures, beliefs and governments.

    I am not English, although I have some English blood in me, as well as German, French, Dutch, Scotch and Irish, and my children have a bit of Seneca Indian in them from their mother's side. My username is from fantasy role-playing which I came to like and use in a lot of other places.

    Yes, I know England's history well and am particularly familiar with the period of Rome's fall and it's impact in England and I don't see your point?
  • Woot! I love a healthy debate on how to deal with Islamism in China
  • JEWHAWK
    I do support the CHINESE GOVERNMENT 100% in this case.Muslims
    are very known troublemakers in every corner of the globe;I do hope
    they understood WHO is the boss there.
  • magiaghaee
    As I hope you understand who the boss is too
  • Tonto
    Don't blame you and agree with you here....all one ever hears about islam and the savage animals that follow such a foul religion is death, death, and more death. Is there such a thing as peace in islam? The answer is pretty self evident when one sees the numbers....Jihad, June 2009
    Attacks......216
    Countries.....21
    Religions.......5
    Dead..........925
    Crit. Inj....1877
    That's a bit sobering isn't it? When we take a look at the NUMBERS and not the BS., there's the REAL story! Islam is worse than any plague that ever was on this earth. Go China....kill 'em all!
  • Well, I don't think that killing (or wishing China to kill) all Muslims is going to solve anything. Uighur Turks are a very little portion of Muslims, and this can get Muslims violent in other parts of the world: the Chinese Embassy in the Netherlands has been attacked this morning by "activists".
    Even if I incur in the zeal of the commenters here, I must say I don't think violence (more than 500 people killed by now) is going to solve anything. China will continue supporting pro-blasphemy resolution in the EU and harrassing everyone who dares believe in God (whatever God, including Jesus, Jehovah or the Marvellous Flying Monster) inside its frontiers.
    States must point out the limits very clearly to Muslims (you don't want to live here, you can go anywhere, where Shariah Law is applied...). But resorting to violence, specially with secret interrogations involving real torture, doesn't solve anything.
    Note: Uighurs have been very violent. I'm in favour of arresting those and sentencing them. But I insist: I don't see really a movement against China throughout the world as it would have happened if the Uighurs would have been repressed by a non-Communist Government.
  • Tonto
    Like I keep saying, the numbers don't lie. Muz all over the world firmly believe in forwarding their agenda with violence and murder. We have a choice to either fight back, or roll over and "convert or die". What do YOU want to do? I'd rather see piles of dead muz (men, women and kiddies....along with their cats and canaries...even their damn goldfish) than see one more Christian murdered by the #@%$&* muz. I really don't give two dead flies how anyone else feels about it.
  • 4peace786
    You have no heart for humanity. You are already dead. Humanity comes with diversity. You still dont know that. EVEN THOUGH YOU SAY YOU DO.
  • Tonto
    So what, exactly does one do with those that insist on violence and war as their selling points? Have you no concept of EVIL? Do you deny EVIL exists? Are you that fricking stupid? The stupidity of appeasers really pisses me off!
  • Storm_Rider
    Ethnic, religious and racial diversity is fine; but diversity of values is not always fine. Totalitarian values and laws found in Nazism, Fascism, Communism and Islamic Sharia are evil.

    You must not be allowed to throw evil in with good and say this is just "diversity," and then expect Americans to accept your evil rendition of "diversity."

    Islamic political, ethnic and religious supremacy over non-Muslims is a type of diversity which violates our Declaration of Independence and Constitution; because our founding documents say that all men are created equal before law; and that women are equal with men as well.

    Jizya taxation of non-Muslims is a form of diversity which violates our Declaration of Independence, because it says we have an individual God-given right to the pursuit of happiness, i.e.: a sacred right to the property for which we have honestly labored.

    Murdering Islamic Jihad is a form of diversity which violates our Declaration of Independence and Bill of Rights, because our founding documents say that we have an individual God-given right to life; and an individual God-given right to defend our lives by bearing arms. This disgusting comment to Tonto: "You are already dead" illustrates the evil of your type of diversity.
  • suleyman
    there is alot that happens in america that goes against the "constitution"

    look at the world bank for example...

    the founding fathers actually banned interest, which is not allowed in islam either.
    a RIGHT to live? dont you think the uighurs have a right to live?

    and he wasnt literally saying ur dead, hes saying you wont live a full life, if you continue with your current values, where hatred comes as such a quick response, you will never live as harmoniously as we.

    4peace786 id like to thank you, you only needed 2 sentences to say what ive been trying to say in pages
  • Storm_Rider
    Our founding fathers didn't ban banking interest, but they did not empower a national banking system controlled by federal government under our Constitution - that is un-Constitutional.

    Hatred of lies and evil is the only hatred allowed by the Bible; and by God, I hate evil. I hate Totalitarian government power whether Fascist, Marxist or Islamist - that violates our Declaration of Independence since such power occurs without the informed consent of the governed, and such power is destructive of our sacred rights to liberty and pursuit of happiness (property). I hate murder, and particularly mass-murder; and in today's world that means I hate Islamic Jihad. Murder violates our Declaration of Independence which says each individual has a sacred right to life; and our Bill of Rights which says each individual has a sacred right to defend life. Even though I've explained it; self-defense requires no explanation.
  • hellosnackbar
    Good unadulterated common sense SR!
    The only people who would take issue with your flawless logic are those whose reason has been damaged by the pernicious Islamic meme.
    Enslavement within their own cerebral cortex!
    They're like chronic alcoholics who fail to admit their personsl problem.
  • magiaghaee
    And constantly deriding an alcoholic helps them get off the booze? I think your common sense has been adulterated by your narrow mind.
  • 4peace786
    And you have not read The Revelations of God, Almighty. Evil are those tht
    keep away from the truth.
  • Storm_Rider
    I've read The Revelations of God Almighty, i.e.: The Holy Bible; and that revelation was a basis for our American Declaration of Independence.

    It is the truth that all men and women are created equal before the God and the law, not unequal, i.e.: to Hell with Islamic supremacism.

    It is truth that all men and women are created with an unalienable God-given right to the pursuit of happiness (property earned through individual labor), i.e.: to Hell with Islamic Jizya taxation of non-Muslims by Totalitarian Islamic government.

    It is truth that all men and women are created with an unalienable God-given right to liberty, i.e.: to Hell with Totalitarian Islamic Sharia Law which suppresses individual freedom of speech, freedom of press, freedom of religion, freedom of assembly, freedom to peaceably petition government, freedom from cruel and unusual punishment, freedom to have privacy at home, etc.

    It is truth that all men and women have an unalienable God-given right to life, i.e.: to Hell with Islamic Jihad torture, murder and mass-murder.
  • Do you think that I am considering how you feel about what I think? No, I don't.
    What do YOU want to do?

    I want to do what is JUST. And violence is the easiest of all solutions, but not the best of all: it just makes the victimization grows. Just see what they are saying about the woman who has been killed in Germany by Neo-Nazi, who had been harrasing her for months, because she was wearing a Hijab.
    Is that OK for you? That's your problem, but if that's the case, it's very related with the meaning of your nickname in Spanish.
  • Tonto
    Typical dodge from a libtard pinko....call names. Apropos. I come from the Tonto Basin, if you must know....probably never heard of it, but it is a national monument....
  • Beejj
    T & P, it seems to me, simple fellow that I am, that eradication of Mohammedans in China will, at a stroke, eliminate the problems they cause. Curtis LeMay said something along these lines, I recall. You point out that Mohammedans throughout the world will raise hell by attacking Chinese embassies and, no doubt, Chinese restaurants. Fair point: Mohammedans are very good at this kind of thing. Should the Chinese Government therefore refrain from dealing with the Mohammedan menace within its own boundaries because of the possibility of such future acts of aggression? Mohammedans the world over pray that the answer to this question will be a resounding YES! It seems that you, too, would respond in the affirmative. I would not.
  • One thing is what China will do and another one what would be cause of happiness. China is not detaining them for being "Muhammedans", China is detaining them just because they believe in God and as in Tibet, don't want to be atheists. China has sent money and weapons to the Talibans, maintained Sudan status, supported Iranian nuclear program, etc. So it's got nothing to do with "anti-jihad" and tomorrow it could be against any other religion (as it happens). AND China is not going to eliminate ALL Muhammedans in China, just as it didn't eliminate ALL Tibetans. China will only eliminate or neutralize (being in prison for 20 or 30 yrs is worse in China than being eliminated before) the people they need to suffocate the rebellion.

    Should the Chinese Government therefore refrain from dealing with the Mohammedan menace within its own boundaries because of the possibility of such future acts of aggression?


    As I wrote before, China has a much more important role here: UN resolution against blasphemy. There is virtually no response against China (except spontaneous attacks but of activists, I never said of "Muslims").
    Remember that the cartoons'riots were absolutely funnelled and paid by Islamic countries. There is no interest in the Islamic world about Uighurs.

    The riots in Europe will be mostly caused by the murder of an Egyptian woman in Germany because allegedly she was wearing the hijab.
  • Beejj
    T & P, you have me confused. You seem to say that the Chinese authorities are kicking Uighur butt because these people believe in God. Surely not. The authorities are locking horns with those who wish to establish a separate state - a new breakaway country. It happens (surprise, surprise) that the would-be rebels are Mohammedans (just as those murderous maniacs in the southern Philippines are Mohammedans), but the Chinese response is not anti-Mohammedan per se.
  • hellosnackbar
    The Uighurs want autonomy from China and will never get it.
    Chinks take no shit from culturally different people within their own borders ;and I predict that any Uighur identified as being a ring leader of this little skirmish will be summarily executed.
    It would not matter a fig if the Uighurs were catholic.
    Any group threatening even the slightest sedition in thePRC
    will simply be annihilated.
    A simple, effective ,brutal approach that western democracies may not employ.
    Being muslim in China is just not sensible.
  • JEWHAWK
    ..."A simple, effective ,brutal approach that western democracies may not employ"

    But they should.It's not a matter of looking good for the cameras and worldwide public opinion.It's a matter of CULTURAL SURVIVAL.
    Islam PROVED that it can't coexist peacefully with anybody.They seek SUPREMACY,
    something utterly incongruent with our way of life.
    The Chinese are RIGHT.
  • magiaghaee
    With that logic I guess Christianity, Hinduism, Buddhism, and Judaism have proved the same thing. Inquisition, Crusades, Sri Lanka Civil War, Israel v Judea, Palestine Mandate pre 1948 etc. Your narrow view of the world will disappoint you one day.
  • suleyman
    when you say ISLAM wants supremacy... what exactly do you mean, im a turkish muslim currently living in australia, and honestly look back in history, it was the white man that tried to assimilate cultures into their own, it was the jew who went into palestine, look at the OTTOMAN rule, they allowed others to practice their own religions and speak their own language, what did white man do? try to completely rid the land of its natives.

    btw this is not from hate, this is the past, we should learn from past mistakes and globalise, these threads should be bringing us together, bridging the gap. not breaking away our cultures and pointing out the differences.

    lets think about it this way Jewhawk, we may believe differently but to see you in pain hurts me still you are still human and therefore considered my brother as i am yours. stop hating ur neighbours and start sharing the world, we have much more resources then we realise
  • JEWHAWK
    Suleyman,I've been to Turkey(1998).I've witnessed how the Kurds are treated.I've witnessed how the ARMENIAN GENOCIDE is DENIED;I've
    seen the large Mosque that once was a CHURCH that was DESECRATED
    in order to be a mosque;The Turkish guide told me so with PRIDE.
    I DESPISE Turkey,Islam and EVERYTHING to do with your damned
    death cult that worship a PEDOPHILE,the DESPICABLE MOHAMMAD.

    Thank you,Sir,for considering this poor Jew a "human".After reading that now
    I can sleep well...

    I will NEVER consider you a "brother",after all Islam says that "Jews are
    sons of pigs and monkeys".

    "Stop hating your neighbours"???
    Tell that to HAMAS,HEZBOLLAH,AL-AQSA MARTYRS BRIGADE,ISLAMIC JIHAD,ABU-SAYAF,the TALIBAN,AL-QAEDA...
  • suleyman
    how can you be so ignorant, how can you still generalise a population that makes up almost a third of the worlds.

    the truth is, its obvious you just want to argue.
    all i want, is for you to understand, we are not so different you and i
  • JEWHAWK
    I am different.Jews are different.We are USEFUL to the rest of mankind.

    Muslims don't.

    Islam is nothing but a dependable source of DEATH,TERRORISM and SOCIAL BACKWARDNESS.
    As we are in the 21th Century,Islam is a strange body.An anachronism that shouldn't exist.
    Suleyman,you and ALL muslims actually belong to the 7th Century.
  • suleyman
    the dark ages, the middle ages.

    when the black death was a plague in europe. the ottomans didnt feel it. why?

    because they already had democracy. they were hygienic, unlike other parts of the world where bathing was only for the rich man, and only once a month.

    7th century? till today, the qur'an supplies us with valuable information that we knew through the qur'an for over a millenia.

    so we arent uncivilized we never wrote the Malleus Maleficarum to kill freethinking women, we never killed astronomers or philosophers for questioning or going against our scriptures.

    galileo galilei, may you rest in peace
  • JEWHAWK
    Suleyman:
    "...the qur'an supplies us with valuable information ..."

    I don't doubt.

    Suleyman: "...we never wrote the Malleus Maleficarum..."

    The "holy" Qu'ran makes the Malleus Maleficarum look like
    a GARFIELD COMIC BOOK.
    **************************************************

    Galileo Galilei,Copernicus,,Isaac Newton,Leonardo da Vinci,Faraday,Watt,Marconi,Descartes,Voltaire,
    Joyce,Kafka,Edison,Bach,Vivaldi,Mozart,Beethoven...

    Not a single muslim in that list.Pity,huh?Why ?
    Because islam is all about BACKWARDNESS and
    SHEER VIOLENCE.That's it.

    And YES.You all,followers of the pedophile and self-proclaimed "prophet" Mohammad,trully belong
    to the 7th Century.
  • Kal_El
    "
    so we arent uncivilized we never wrote the Malleus Maleficarum to kill
    freethinking women, we never killed astronomers or philosophers for
    questioning or going against our scriptures."

    I know, you kill freethinking women and those who question your scriptures
    today. Regarding the dark and middle ages, if islam is so great, why did the
    kuffar surpass islam a thousand times over, during the past 3 centuries
    (using the Siege of Vienna, but the muslim Ottoman Empire as the last time
    anyone gave a crap about islam before 1948)?
  • Kal_El
    Suleyman,

    How on earth do you arrive at the conclusion that 1 billion people equal
    almost one third of the world? Are you ignorant of the fact that there are
    approximately 6.5 billion people on this planet? Apparently we ARE
    different, you and I. I understand simple concepts of math, including
    percentages and fractions. You do not.
  • suleyman
    and because of my bad mathematics skills its enough to say i have no right to live?
  • Kal_El
    Just a second there, professor. No one said you do not have the right to
    live. You ABSOLUTELY have the right to live. And you have the right to
    worship your pedophile hero, Muhammad also. My beef begins when islamists
    infringe on MY right to live, and MY right to worship whom I choose.
  • Necrowulf
    Hellosnackbar answer everything;
    But i feel compelled to answer this

    " it was the jew who went into palestine "

    So, are you saying jerusalem is for muslims?
    Are you saying that hundreds and thousands of years of judaism in that area never existed?

    Can you PLEASE for the love of god, return constantinople to the greeks?
  • suleyman
    sorry necrowolf to offend you, but dont put words in my mouth.

    you completely missed the point there, i was trying to help you guys comprehend a little fact.

    violence is in people
    faith is in people

    the egyptians slaved jews for thousands of years before islam was around.

    faiths of christ enslaved blacks for hundreds of years when islam was around, when islam was allowing christians to practice their own and even jews to practice their own in our democracy.

    people can be dated back to about 36000 years i believe, and even then faith was around.
    it seems to me its easier for the ignorant to point the finger of blame on someone else rather than to seek that same hatred, and those same mistakes in themselves.

    i speak for myself and many many muslims, muslims in australia.
    we do not condone violence, this is, and always has been a product of the media.

    why is it so easy for you to hate us? when im making all the effort to enlighten you.

    im a muslim! shouldnt i be fighting and you be passively resisting to show me the light?

    the truth is where do all faiths come from? they were all introduced for peace, harmony, self-control.

    we believe in the miracles of christ, also in the harsh conditions moses had to lead the people of his time.
    but in every faith it is for GOD to judge, for ALLAH or CHRIST, no one else has that right.

    no religion says kill the unbelievers, or those with beliefs that are slightly different from yours, this happens out of ignorance, from the lack of education, from irrational acts, from NOT listening.

    did i say palestine is for muslims? no, but like america is multicultural, and like i can live in peace with hebrews and talk about our different beliefs(however minor they are) in australia, without the use of violent and irrational behaviour, so should we all.
  • hellosnackbar
    Well Suleyman,there you are! as a minority person in a civilised democracy well away from the backward culture of your origin.
    Think what your great leader Attaturk thought about Islam:"a necklace of skulls about the neck of reason"
    Sadly his legacy is being defiled by muslim madmen in modern day Turkey and it is only the educated Turks and the army which serve to protect it.
    Turkey has the potential to be a great nation if they can only cast off
    the "dead hand"of the silliest death cult known to man.
    Educated Turks know this and it is no surprise that they have identified the real enenemy to their prosperity; in a word Islam.
  • Bronwyn
    No, you are not killing these commentators. You are systematically lying to them. Your taqqiya will bring you no points here. Muslims sold Africans into slavery as they had been doing long before Europeans apppeared to buy slaves. Islam deals in dehumanization and rapacious murder;it always has.

    Your religion requires you to imitate and revere the life of Mohammad, the pedophile, murderer and liar. You are therefore doomed to emulate and reproduce his violent behavior, his sexual inadequacy resulting in the rape of children and the brutalization of women.

    His hatred of Jews is rooted in jealousy. Here he had and you have a big problem. The Jews are so massively creative and productive that Islam cannot begin to compete.
    Israel's astonishing ability is God's signature on this people.

    The rebirth of Israel is according to the timetable of the Bible. Her reappearance after 2500 years of absence of its people being scattered all over the earth is unprecedened in history and predicted in the Bible. The same Bible also states that the nations which surround Israel will seek to destroy her and will be unable to do so. THe BIble says that GOD himself will fight for Israel and that it will take six months to bury all the dead of those who have come against her.
    These events are refered to by Jesus, the Messiah, in the New Testament and are a reason that Muslims hate Christians.

    Many Muslims have abandoned their religion of jealousy and hatred and found forgiveness and the life in Jesus. I recommend Him to you. Despite al the resentment that Islam has created through its evil ways, the people trapped in this religion remain precious to God. But HE will not alow you to run rampant over the earth You have a decision to make. You need a Savior as do we all.
    I think that you suspect that you fight againast GOd in your fight against the Jews. No, Israel is not always right, but GOd will not leave
    any nation unpunished which seeks to destroy her.

    Many Muslims have come to Jesus seeking refuge from the sicknes of Islam. THey are now free to live life without the chains of jealousy and rage and lies which now bind you. Jesus had a pwerful love for HIs creation but He is also just. Stop lying to everyone and to yourself. Islam is evil and doomed to eventually fail.
  • Kal_El
    Bronwyn,

    THANK YOU! That was well said. Nearly all the people I know of African
    descent have no clue about the Arab slave trade, and that it is STILL GOING
    today, in places like Mauritania.
  • Kal_El
    You talk of slavery, as if muslims never practiced it. WRONG. I see it every day in the muslim world, where I happen to live. Muslims lure in outsiders to work as maids, day laborers, etc... then withhold their passports, often forcing them to work 7 days a week 12-14 hours a day, and not paying them their promised wage. I have seen that in Qatar, Kuwait, Lebanon, Jordan, Egypt, the UAE, and Bahrain. All of it sanctioned by the quran, which purports to be the word of allah as revealed to Mohammed, who himself held slaves. Jesus did not. See the difference?
  • suleyman
    brother, you are angry before you started.

    you too have missed the point, we all make mistakes.

    can i be blamed for the bastards that hold passports. is that what im preaching here?

    can you be blamed for the sins of others. just because your a certain faith, can we punish you for what ur ancestors have done?

    right now i dont care about what jesus did and didnt do.
    right now, in this situation, WHAT WOULD JESUS DO?,
    would he keep blaming people or would he try to get the root of the racism, the lack of understanding from both sides.

    im sure there would be many muslims going against what im saying here, but then there would be many jews and christians that would agree also. which is my point.

    we should all help eachother, always, we shouldnt argue the points but learn from them
  • funkybarfly
    Suleyman.If you would please just ask your fellow Muslims to stop having children at three times the rate of everybody else, things will look after themselves.
    Peace.
  • hellosnackbar
    Dear Suleyman(the magnificent),
    The Ottomans were also brutal if any movement arose to oppose them.
    Almost certainly some Chink has studied Mein
    Quranf and arrived at the conclusion that Islam
    is a global political movement seeking to dominate the world on the imaginary Allah's orders.
    This is of course totally contrary to everything a communist government stands for and opposition which employs murder will be rapidly snuffed out.(as indeed any responsible government would).
    Islam is permitted in China;but any proseletysing which even hints at sedition will be dealt with.
    Imams are state licensed and all sermons are
    monitored by the authorities.
    I suppose what really irritates Uighurs is the Hans(the majority)laughing at and deriding their quaint beliefs.
  • suleyman
    lets not start pointing the finger, because if we were to look back, lets look at the crusades, enemies of the pope? what exactly does that mean? lets look at the Malleus Maleficarum and kill all free thinking women?! when did islam ever order such tyranny, also lets not forget the violent reaction of the chinese government which for some reason seems to be applauded rather than harshly opposed, why? because theyre not muslim?!, i think we should be equally biased and not just products of the media(lets not react to things we hear in the media like 911[which i think by now we all know for what it is]): Uighurs want what jews and kurds have been fighting for, their independence, the truth is, "violence" is in people not in religion(did the muslims kill neanderthal?) people are violent, but education is the key, the only way to bring us together. open room in ur heart for me, u have been in my heart for years, i dont judge people on things as futile as religion and the truth is none of us have the right to judge anyone, am i a stereotypical muslim? what exactly does that mean? i dont wear a scarf or support terrorism, do you?
  • 4peace786
    I dont support terrrorism but do defend my identity and my people just as much the muslim people can do in the chinese government. They are little propotion of muslim. its not fair what kind of government is this. that kills people shoudn't they just come to TERMS WITH THE MUSLIMS IDEA , give them a place to pray & practice their belief. Its seems like the government is not for humanity its for dominating even the little portion of differnece. When Islam ruled before the european occupation & the crusader, wwhich killed many muslims, True Jewish, & True Christianity, The nonmuslim lived in harmony under the Islam State 4 many years. Islam was the one brought humanity many & it will always will be. Get to knwo the real hiestory of this world. Islam in spain brought many benefits to them. Before Islam they didnt know how to live civil, about showers, science, medicines. The spainards didnt know tht male should have short hair and girls should have long hair. Islam brought civilization to those people. Then they with evil thought fought back and tried they best to burn evidence tht Islam ever existed in thier land . When it brought them prosperity. Same thing with The Dark Ages of Europe. THROUGHOUT HISTORY THERE IS NO CREDIT TO ISLAM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Now look at chinese government where is the democracy or peace . Chinese, American, Australian, European Government are the terrorist killing civilians like Afghanistan, Iraq, Pakistan, now the little portion, Uighurs, in China. What next!!!#$#@%$^&!!!!!!! Its war on ISLAM.!#$@$@$%##!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Many people dont have homes in Pakistan, there is no food in Iraq. There are no SCHOOLS in Afghanistan . Afghanistan is a poor country how did they get weapons. Weapons are from Bush. Before the 9/11 attack Bush invited the Taliban, or Al-Qaida i dont care , they are the same, LEADER to America to show him oil pipes for the ground under the land. Bush seized his oppurtuinity and invaded Afaghanistan and brought weapons. Now Osma bin Laden, Nobody knows about this, was mudered BEFORE 9/11 attack. All the tapes Bush has shown the people of america was outdated. If you watch those tapes on youtube. Osama Had black beard in few tapes and in many other tapes Osama had white beard . That doesnt make any sense. How could he ahve done it. On the paksitan channel it was reported before 9/11 attack tht Osama was MURDERED!!!!!!!!!! All falsehood will NEVER not stand 4ever, Truth will prevail!!!!!!!!!!!! There was Prophet Muhammad(peace and blessing be upon him). There will always be 4ever THE REVELATION, THE QURAN. ISLAM IS PEACE 4 ALL HUMAINTY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Cüneyt Cihan I am a Turkish citizen. Chinese Government is killing our brethren. The massacre is done. Genocide is made. Let our voice heard them. Please give us your support. Please boycott of Chinese goods!

    "The main problem is the government's attitude. If they continue their discriminative policies and keep seeing the Uighurs as troublemakers and terrorists, the problem will never end."
    In a repressive situation, she went on, coexistence was artificial because the conflict had not been resolved and the wounded would continue to seek justice.


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SOquXklFyS8

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a6w3LUEGyNQ&feat...

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3fgfdcdidNU&feat...
  • JEWHAWK
    "Cüneyt Cihan I am a Turkish citizen. Chinese Government is killing our brethren. The massacre is done. Genocide is made. Let our voice heard them. Please give us your support. Please boycott of Chinese goods!"

    I will BOYCOTT Turkish products.
    What does Turkey makes?
    Ahh.Olive Oil and pistachios.
  • Kal_El
    @ JEWHAWK,

    DAMMIT MAN, I love olive oil!! Guess I will have to make sure to buy from
    Cyprus, Greece or Italy :P
  • Kal_El
    I have a problem with your statement, "Genocide is made.". If 156 dead muslims is genocide, then what do you call the 1,000,000 Armenians slaughtered by the Turks in 1918? What do you call the 2900+ Americans who died on 9/11?
  • suleyman
    i think you need to do a little more research on your history before you make blind accusations kal_el
  • hellosnackbar
    The best way to world peace would be for Muslims to dump Islam and join the 21st century.
    Why are they so reluctant?
    They retort that all will be peaceful when the whole world is Islamic!(hence their murdering for peace paradox)
    Well! I'll fight and kill to oppose such a nightmare!
  • 4peace786
    You really are blind.
  • Beejj
    Yes, HSB, I agree with you. Unless I am misreading him, T&P seems to think the Chinese actions in northwest China are about suppressing a religion, but it is not the case.
  • JEWHAWK
    Dear T&P:

    You're a reasonable and forgiving person.The people whom you defend,
    is NOT.
    If the so-called "uigurs" were in the Chinese boots,instead of 500 people
    dead,you could count 10,000 or more.Muslim ruthlessness toward its
    non-muslim subjects is widely know throughout history.They shown no
    mercy to the Greeks,Armenians,Hindus...
    Chinese people know better.They are aware of the pestilence and sheer
    EVIL that Islam means,thus they SHOULD react accordingly.

    I urge all people who loves democracy to NOT mistake this confrontation
    with 1989's Tianamen Square.This Uighur's ruckus has absolutely NOTHING
    to do with fighting for democracy.They are fighting to create ANOTHER
    islamic monstrosity:An UIGHUR STATE.

    China has an international DUTY to CRUSH this nightmare in its very
    craddle.
    This ought to be the same modus operandi to deal with the other muslim
    attempts to achieve statehood in different spots such as KOSOVO and "palestine".
    People who support the muslims simply are NAÏVE and CLUELESS.
  • funkybarfly
    Spot on JEWHAWK!
    This is the tried and true muslim method of expansion.
    Harass the locals until they give up or fight back in which case they appeal to the UN(don't get me started)to stop the "genocide" against THEM.I'm glad you mentioned Kosovo because this is identical,except the Americans are not likely make a move here;China is a completely different kettle of fish.
    The world should take careful note of what the Chinese are doing here and feel no arkwardness in emulating them to the letter.
    For once...just for once the disingenuous bastards have bitten off more than they can chew.
  • Sorry, JewHawk, but you're wrong. I'm not defending the Uighurs. I'm just considering that violence there (i.e. killing all Muslims there) is NOT going to solve the problem of general Islamism/Islamic terrorism/Islamic fundamentalism or how you want to call it. What we have is a problem of showing the limits to Muslims, not of being as violent as they are.
    Is that being naïve? No, I don't think so, that's being pragmatic. We have to adress the problem to find a solution. I repeat: I really don't think that China killing Uighur Muslims is a solution to a way of thinking, way of thinking that's our real problem. Why? Because all the acts of terrorism/violence/barbarism have an actual basis and it's that basis the one which must be addressed.
    Unless that's addressed (and our countries have that very clear, something they don't have actually, only see the reactions to the Sarkozy's Burqa ban ideas) the problem of Islamic extremism/fundamentalism/terrorism or even if you want, the Islamic problem is not going to find a solution.
    Yeah, I know, we are not going to agree on this. I have disputed with many people about it: being Spanish, I know this is not going to have a very easy solution. What's more, we had 800 yrs of Muslim rule, with three absolutely violent invasions afterwards of AQ's ideological ancestors. And 600 yrs after the end of Muslim rule, we are confronted by a much deeper problem. During that time, everyone knew what their place was. Now, multiculturalism has precisely attacked the basis of all: the commitment of each citizen to the defense of its community, deemed as not the "best" one, so why we have to defend it?. For me, that's the real problem: the doubts of not knowing who we are.
    Even if we treat them as "islamonazis" don't be mistaken: Nazism didn't speak about the after-life, and that's a very powerful thing to consider.
  • SirWilhelm
    Nazis were very concerned with religion and occult symbols and power. Raiders of the Lost Ark was based on fact, they never found the Ark though. The swastika is a "twisted cross", isn't it? In another post here you say, "China is detaining them just because they believe in God" referring to the Uighars' Muslim belief in "god". I have to assume you meant Allah when you say "God". Publicly, Muslims do claim that the Jewish and Christian "God" and Allah are one and the same, but actually, the Quran itself states tha Allah himself claims to be a superior "god" over Jehovah, and all other "gods". The cry "Allahu akhbar" means "Allah is greater", not "Allah is great", as is usally assumed. Those beliefs preclude Allah being the same "god" anyone else worships. As for the Chinese Communists, they embrace atheism as one of their tenants, obviously, and only tolerate any religion inside their borders because they are so hard to eradicate, and actually seem to flourish under persecution.

    The term "islamonazis" really fits their similarities. Islam and Nazism are both political oranizations that used similar means to obtain and hold power. They use the trappings of religion to disguise their political nature. Terror is the ultimate source of their power, their own people fear to oppose them. which made the demonstrations in Iran so suprising, and we saw why they were so courageous when the govt responded.

    Communism is another name for the same kind of politcal force, with the exception that atheism makes them anti-religious. Ultimately, totalitarianism is the goal of all of them, call the "supreme leader" what you will.
  • JEWHAWK
    Holá,T&P!!

    "being Spanish, I know this is not going to have a very easy solution."

    Osama Bin Laden said he'll stop at nothing until Spain be TAKEN.For Al-Qaeda,
    Spain BELONGS to the muslim Ummah.Did you know that you live in an "occupied
    territory"?


    "We have to adress the problem to find a solution."

    My dear,the Uighurs want some sort of sovereignty or,at least,a little
    autonomy from Beijing.This will NOT going to happen.NOBODY has
    ANY clout over Beijing decision-making.China isn't Israel that would
    bulge according to Washington's whims.

    Once that claim doesn't fullfill now or in the future,the Uighurs will
    resume in their protests and the Chinese heavy hand will smack right
    into their middle.Unlike Israel,China IGNORES human rights COMPLETELY,
    therefore you can expect THOUSANDS of dead Uighurs ahead.

    In 1951,China invaded Tibet.Did SOMEONE have the nerve to fight for
    the Dalai Lama?
    Heck no.Nobody is CRAZY to wage war against China.Even less to protect
    a rabidly dangerous bunch of people.

    Europe will have only ONE option to remain a democratic continent,
    with FULL women's rights,something 100% anti-islamic:
    GET RID OF ALL MUSLIMS.Period.
    Keeping the status quo will bring Europe to its knees.Islam will CONQUER
    the WHOLE Europe,Islamize it and CANCEL the French Revolution's social
    achievements.
  • Did you know that you live in an "occupied
    territory"?
    After more than 4 years in the anti-jihad, I think that yeah, I knew that before you told me about it. In fact, there are Muslims who have spoken freely about "we came by the sea, you will be going next when we have reached power".

    So yes, I did know that. I have that very present each time I write a post. But I think that Spanish society would need to get a taste on that. Just to see what they are not fighting actively now because they are not convinced we are menaced really. :P

    Europe will have only ONE option to remain a democratic continent, with FULL women's rights,something 100% anti-islamic: GET RID OF ALL MUSLIMS.Period.
    Keeping the status quo will bring Europe to its knees.Islam will CONQUER the WHOLE Europe,Islamize it and CANCEL the French Revolution's social achievements.

    And European status quo, how is going to be modified by what's happening in China? It won't be. Chinese internal affairs have nothing to do with European internal affairs. That's why I wrote this:
    multiculturalism has precisely attacked the basis of all: the commitment of each citizen to the defense of its community, deemed as not the "best" one, so why we have to defend it?. For me, that's the real problem: the doubts of not knowing who we are.
    Europeans don't know what and why are they fighting for. Or even IF they have to fight at all. And that's not going to change because China kills or not a bunch of revolted Uighurs. In fact, I doubt that 99% of European population would know what's an Uighur. We are in summer holidays, remember?
    What should Europe do about Islam? There is an important number of believers who are European nationals. There are Muslims who have denounced Islamic extremism (ie: Abu Hamza case), nearly being mocked about, to the insecurity of the rest of society. European Govts have paid enormous sums to extremist association while liberal Muslims haven't got any money. So it's not only a question of Islam (dangerous as it is); it's a question of not defending OUR own heritage (Greek, ROman, Judaeo-Christian...), because it's OUR own and have produced the best of the progresses on Earth...
  • JEWHAWK
    "So it's not only a question of Islam (dangerous as it is); it's a question of not defending OUR own heritage (Greek, ROman, Judaeo-Christian...), because it's OUR own and have produced the best of the progresses on Earth..."

    Quite right.But are the (real)Europeans aware that ALL they have is in jeopardy?
    Why the mainstream european media doesn't blow the whistle?
    Why real patriots such as Geert Wilders are treated so harshly and even called "racist"?

    "Chinese internal affairs have nothing to do with European internal affairs"

    It should.The Chinese are dealing with their islamic TERMITES according to the
    threat that they actually represent.Europeans don't.After WWII,Europeans became
    spineless.

    To have a functional democracy,each country has to pay a price ,namely to DEFEND it
    by whatever means deemed necessary,including VIOLENCE.
    The muslims are using and abusing of the democratic european laws to OUTGROW their
    native christian neighbors with the sole purpose of achieving a majority,thus giving
    them the right to abolish laws and whole constitutions,to IMPOSE the Shari'a Law upon
    EVERYBODY.
    For the muslims,Democracy is just a very useful ladder in which to climb up
    to the highest european political niches,only to discard this ladder afterward.Hugo
    Chávez did exactly that in Venezuela.
  • Why the mainstream european media doesn't blow the whistle?

    People are not interested in this kind of things. They consider that a possible Islamic takeover is not very probable. And then there is the economic crisis or corruption to worry about, things that people see as much nearer.

    Why real patriots such as Geert Wilders are treated so harshly and even called "racist"?

    Well, 2 things:
    a) traditional political parties are fearful of losing their statuses.
    b) Wilders is, except in immigration, a liberal (American way): he is for a greater intervention of State in economy, a bigger state and all that. People who have voted him now think that he is a traditional tipe. He is not. And I am doubtful that, if he gains power, can retain his majority very much.
    About Islam's criticism and his consideration as a "racist" because of that, I only have to say that's absurd: islam is not a race nor is determined by a race. And English BNP is certainly anti-Jewish and racist and no MSM has said that about them. Why? Traditional parties are fearful of losing their statuses and Wilders is now 2nd and can even win the elections. BNP has won 2 seats, so it's not a very dangerous party for the "establishment".

    It should.

    Well, possibly: but it's July and the beach or the swimming-pool are very tempting, aren't they?

    To have a functional democracy,each country has to pay a price ,namely to DEFEND it
    by whatever means deemed necessary,including VIOLENCE

    I told that same thing the other day to a US leftist and he nearly considered me as a very freaky pro-dictators, regarding Honduras' question.
    But one thing is to recognise that State must use violence to defend its citizens and another very different one is saying "heyyy, kill the Muslims... they are @€@#". The first thing is a fact but a not very desirable one, the second is a bad-taste feeling. From my point of view.

    For the muslims,Democracy is just a very useful ladder in which to climb up
    to the highest european political niches,only to discard this ladder afterward.Hugo
    Chávez did exactly that in Venezuela.

    I'm not denying that: just read Turkish Erdogan's quotes about "democracy being a bus and Sharia its destination", or something similar. But does that mean that ALL Muslims think that? I really believe that it's only a question of power from the elites who maintain the people uncultivated and dependant on State/Families/Tribes so their statutes can't be rattled...
    Oh, and a lot of "democratic" guys really envy Hugo Chávez... but not all countries have sooo many oil to buy some wills.
  • JEWHAWK
    ..."Islam is worse than any plague that ever was on this earth. Go China....kill 'em all!"

    Dear Tonto,I couldn't write better.In a situation like that it's far
    easier and more common to support the "weakest" side,something
    that simply cannot be applied here,when it comes a muslim horde trying
    to create ANOTHER islamic entity,the very last thing the world
    needs.
    The SAME can be said about another islamic ABERRATION,a state-to-be
    called 'palestine",that will be just like the Iranian fingers around Israel's neck,
    paid by America,Europe and the Saudis.
  • fghjkoihg
    thats an interesting thing to say

    "worse than any plague that ever was on this earth... kill em all"

    that is exactly what Hitler said about the jews...
    now a jew is saying it about another religion.... mmm funny how hatred and ignorance always sound the same
  • JEWHAWK
    I do not regret not a single word I've been writing in this blog.You can't compare
    the European Jewry,people which had Albert Einstein,Niels Böhr,Lise Meitner,
    Sigmund Freud,Franz Kafka,Otto Klemperer,Kandinsky,Chagall,Vladimir Horowitz,
    Arthur Rubinstein among MANY other famous people with Muslims,the SCUM of
    the Earth.
    We did not DESERVE to be murdered by the millions.We did not THREAT anyone,
    we did not issue any fatwa to kill people,make SUICIDE-BOMBINGS,HIJACK AIRLINERS,
    try to impose the Halacha(Jewish Law) upon the others...
    Jews DID contribute to enhance SCIENCE,MUSIC,ARTS,FILOSOPHY...muslims don't.

    Do I HATE Muslims?
    You betcha.
    Is it a wanton hatred?
    Nope.I've got TRUCKLOADS of evidence to justify my hatred toward Islam.

    Do I actually want to "kill'em all"?
    Nope.I want to see them EXPELLED (deported) from America,Australia,Brazil,Argentina,Israel and Europe;
    This matter isn't funny at all.It's all about Western Culture's SURVIVAL.I care for it.If you don't,is not my business.
  • SirWilhelm
    Hard to choose sides here. As pointed out, the Uighurs are Muslims, and from what I've read about their actions here, are acting like it, brutally attacking Chinese civilians, especially women. As for the Chinese, it seems nothing has changed for them as far as putting down demonstrations or uprisings, brutallity is the order of the day for them. Might as well let them fight it out, since we can't or wouldn't do anything anyway.
  • Yes, it's truly hard. I will do an update afterwards. But what really impresses me is that, if that kind of repression against Muslims would have been done by any other non-Communist country, the condemnation would have been much more severe. The White House, for example, has only said that "they are very much worried", Obama hasn't made any comment, just as with Iranian revolution...
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