Eric Holder’s “Al Qaeda 7″ have been identified

The people of NYC do not want the trial there, they do not want to be a theater for KSM to spew his propaganda and rhetoric on. They are also concerned that NYC will become a target for terrorism, not just eh immediate area of the tral, but the whole city. Israel's justice system is similar to ours, but not the same, they had their own reasons for trying him the way they did.

These "Holder lawyers" were not assigned, they worked for firms for organizations that had their own agendas concerning the war in Iraq and their own ideas of peace and justice, such as wanting to close Gitmo as Obama is trying to do, and defended them of their own volition. There was no need for a warning since they are already in the DOJ, it's Holder that is being asked to defend hiring them. The fact they defended terrorists implies sympathy for them, and implies that Holder also has sympathy for them, and his firm lead the attempt to get the military tribunals dismantled, which is why Bush was forced to try some terrorists in civilian courts until the tribunal issue was clarified, which it was, and why they are available for Obama to use, although he chooses not to. And the argument comes full circle. Why have a civilian trial in NYC when they are now ready to do the job they were intended to do?

If it's because New Yorkers don't want it (though Bloomberg and Guiliani have flip-flopped on the matter), I respect that. Show me the polls and I'm in. I'm an ex-NYC resident, I would gladly fly back to see the trial should it happen, but if the whole city doesn't want it, the gesture is empty. The terrorism target concern and the rhetoric matter, not so much. We're always going to be targeted by someone, and I doubt his rhetoric is of much concern. Ahmadinajad and Qadafi spoke in NYC, we just laughed at them.

Now I'm going to trust your knowledge on the Holder lawyers matter, but I will try and read up on the matter just to be 'fair and balanced' :). Overall, I still feel that sympathy to terrorists is a spurious allegation to make against them. I mean, it's like calling the ACLU pedo-lovers for defending NAMBLA(I do realize many people hate the ACLU, so that could be a bad example). As for dismantling the tribunals and Gitmo, I think you're revealing that this is more an attack on Obama and his sympathizers than a legitimate case. Like I said, I'll have to read more.
Trying KSM in a military court would defy the purpose of publicly showing him and the world that we are above Saddam Hussein-type trials. Overall, it's important to uphold and image of dignity and courage. We should do all we can to avoid making KSM some sort of martyr.

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/...

Spurious or not, that's the concern, and perceptions are important, but, that's also why concerned people are asking for more information. The dismantling of Gitmo and the tribunals are legitmate issues because Obama has been unable to come up with alternatives to either that work or satisfy the public, as the KSM trial in NYC demonstrates.

Saddam Hussein's trial was condemend as a kangaroo court, but it was not a military tribunal, it was called the Iraqi Special Tribunal and consisted of 5 civilian judges. Thanks to Holder and other opponents of our military tribunals, they have been vetted by years of judicial reviews and in no way could be seen as kangaroo courts. Besides, what should we care what the world thinks? Especially the Muslim world? Has Obama's pleas for friendship or abject apologies changed anything? And there's no way to avoid making KSM a martyr, any Muslim that dies during jihad is considered a martyr, even if they're just bystanders, which is why suicide bombers don't care how many Muslims die when they try to kill infidels, and more Muslims die from terrorist attacks than anyone else. No matter what we do to KSM, they will consider him a martyr, actually, they already see him as a hero. Our enemies already see us as the Great Satan, only our destruction will satisfy them. They see our dignity and courage as arrogance.

I can think of more than a few things wrong with Gitmo. Shutting it down should have happened. But ultimately, it was too much of a rushed plan. It doesn't call anything serious into question, because when the issues came up the pushing for it stopped.

Now you make a startlingly good point about the martyr deal. There's no PR wins with the Muslims. You know Obama is just as vilified as Bush? We're all one America to them. Iranians have pictures of him with swastikas and stars of david. Also, they got pissed when Gibbs said "Khalid Sheikh Mohammed is going to meet justice and he'll meet his maker".

But I refer mostly to the opinions our allies would have of us. Rallying support for anti-Jihadism and forming coalitions is always a key foreign policy objective. And the trial would get us international points that would greatly aid our overseas support. After Iraq, Bush's critics were suprised to learn that overall, he really did clear the war with everyone before going in (defeating the term 'Bush's illegal war). The moral high ground is a precious resource. Basically having our cake and eating it too.

I just came across this: http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2010/03/05/tommy...

By the same logic, trying KSM in NYC is a good idea. Because Israel arrested Adolf Eichman and gave him a civilian trial in Tel Aviv, producing massive mountains of incontrovertible evidence and deliberating over dozens of clemency requests before finally making Eichman the only man ever executed in Israeli civilian court (no tears shed for him, even Nazi generals in hiding provided conclusive testimony against him).

As for the Holder lawyers, Eichman himself had a lawyer assigned, because in a court of law a criminal will get a lawyer as part of the proceedings.So the Nazi parable does not work out very nicely, because we tried terrorists and terror suspects as civvies under Bush and so they inevitably had lawyers. It would have been prudent to inform these lawyers that complying with the US decisions to assign legal representation to terrorists would ultimately lower them in the eyes of the conservatives and potentially end their careers. But they received no such warning, because no one cared. Long as Bush was in charge, we knew things were smooth. Additionally, It does not enter the domain of a 'conflict of interest' since these lawyers are not visibly emotional or sympathetic to Al-Qaeda. If this were a matter of the DOJ hiring lawyers with sketchy backgrounds who had gone to some off-color meetings, it would be completely irresponsible to hire them, and moreover they should be disbarred.

A bullet in his head, right now, next to a pig sty where they throw the body to the hogs would work fine for me. Why bother at all with an expensive trial? Feed the muz scumbag to the hogs.

Mazabdul, the cost to do the KSM trial in New York would be too high. Over 200 million Dollars.

Other thing...KSM isn't an U.S. citizen, therefore he isn't entitled to enjoy Constitutional Rights,
as ZAZI is.

I'm well aware of the cost. Now since the war itself has been cutting no corners whatsoever, we know it's not a real concern. Americans seemed to believe a war which hemorrhaged public funds was alright, and they never even checked to see if the money was being managed (admittedly, Bush had a clever way of getting the cash, writing it off as emergency fund til his last day in office). It's 3 trillion dollars too late for that excuse.

And this is an actual part of that war. It is a true victory over the terrorists. So I ask you once more. Why didn't Israel just take Eichmann off to a quiet room and off him? Why not throw him to a mob and render Biblical Justice? Because they needed to show strength, resilience and justice more than anything. So effectively, we can follow the model

Surely, Eichmann was brought to trial in order to disabuse the growing ranks of Holocaust deniers? Am I mistaken?

" Why not throw him to a mob and render Biblical Justice "

Israel wasn't and it ain't Fallujah or Damascus... Eichmann's trial should've been impecable or it would've been seen as a " Jewish Kangaroo Court", invalidating Israel's legitimacy to pursuit former Nazis and their henchmen throughout the planet. And It was impecable.

A Nazi camp guard, the Ukranian John Demjanuk faced a trial in Israel and was freed due lack
of evidence about his identity. Now he's a prisoner in Germany for BEING the one
Israel was actually looking for...

Maybe America should wait for a bigger fish to fry, so to speak, through its civillian legal system.
I reckon that nobody would oppose to see the Sheikh Usama bin Laden being prosecuted in New
York City.

Bin Laden would certainly hire the team of attorneys who defended O. J. Simpson.

"Israel ain't Fallujah"
And the USA is? I'm saying if Israel felt it was right, why can't America do the same?

Mazabdul, are you trying to compare Eichmann to Khalid Sheikh Mohammad ?

Let's make clear some distinctions about both cases.

I do support an U.S. Military Trial for KSM. It's not a Kangaroo Court and by any stretch of imagination a lynching mob either. He'd have an attorney and all the time he'd require to defend himself.

Well, Eichmann was a military man, with uniform, patent, medals and whatever other stuff that made him a bona fide WAR CRIMINAL.
He wasn't a terrorist, so to speak...maybe worse.

Khalid Sheikh Mohammad is a civillian and a terrorist...

As I've said before, it'd be better to save resources to prosecute Bin Laden, should he'd ever be caught.

Well...maybe you could be right. It's a plausible point. I think that I couldn't make a reasonable case for
what I wrote earlier.

JEWHAWK: Thank you, now why don't the American people think this logical? We have a socialist pig for a POTUS, of which will get him nowhere fast. GRRRRR

GRRRRRRR
Maybe the problem the president is having stems from people growling and calling him names. It's okay. No one's listening. Call him a coon already. I know it must be bothering you to hold it in. Instead of getting on board the demagogue express, make some sense of your speech

*insert random animal noise*